INCREDIBLE HULK - TV Series Revisitation Thread

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AndyDursin
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INCREDIBLE HULK - TV Series Revisitation Thread

#1 Post by AndyDursin »

I decided to start a thread as I go through these episodes on Blu-Ray...like visiting old friends, or at least material buried deep in my psyche seeing as I saw them when I was a kid!

The Fabulous Films UK release is well-done though the black levels seem a bit much...show is too dark and needs to have the brightness turned up on the TV.

PILOT EPISODE
Bill Bixby -- and I know this is no shocker here -- acts his rear-end off in this show. He's warm, relatable, and absolutely perfect for this part, and really is the reason this show worked at all. Kenneth Johnson wrote and directed the pilot and the best output of the series, and this initial pilot episode is extremely well-executed, eerie and kind of creepy at the same time. Susan Sullivan, coincidentally my Godmother's first cousin, also shines as the scientist whose demise forms the central premise of the show. Holds up well, even through some of Joe Harnell's most hysterical musical passages.

A DEATH IN THE FAMILY (aka RETURN OF THE INCREDIBLE HULK)
William Daniels, a young Gerald McRaney, and ill-fated "Jaws 2" writer Dorothy Tristan Guest Star in this second TV-movie of the show. Basically, Banner is dropped into a mystery worthy of "Columbo" as a paralyzed girl is really being poisoned by her family. This episode sets the tone for a lot of the series' subsequent hours, and it's quite entertaining, also yielding this priceless moment of unintentional comedy along the way:


Eric Paddon
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Re: INCREDIBLE HULK - TV Series Revisitation Thread

#2 Post by Eric Paddon »

In general I've found the series to be one that played the "Fugitive" angle a bit less successfully. The key thing that infuriates me is that the most famous line delivered in the series, Bixby's "You wouldn't like me angry" to Jack McGee is virtually the ONLY time our Fugitive and his Gerard like nemesis ever confront each other face to face unless there is a device of bandages covering the face or amnesia. That's because the series IMO made a big mistake by not having Jack McGee at some point along the way realize that Dr. Banner was not dead and that he was the Hulk. It was possible to have him realize this *without* being able to prove it and thus, you could have the occasional episode of the two directly confronting each other which on "The Fugitive" often yielded some of the best moments with David Janssen and Barry Morse would confront each other. But because the series never moved things forward to this point (they only did to the extent that McGee realized that the Hulk is a man who transforms into the creature) it left things very unsatisfying for me and harder to rewatch the episodes. When I watch "The Fugitive" I feel reassured knowing that eventually Dr. Kimble does get vindicated in the last episode and I can appreciate the episodes on their own terms. But in "Hulk" there isn't that level of satisfaction (they did come up on occasion with a couple good episodes that at least let David talk about his past like the "Interview With the Hulk" episode).

One thing that got lost in the shuffle over time though is the fact that the events of the pilot that lead to Susan Sullivan's death is really indirectly the fault of Jack McGee for hiding in the storage room and knocking over the chemicals that cause the explosion. There is no evidence to indicate David ever realized this was the cause of what happened, and logically it is the one piece of evidence that would "clear" the Hulk of a non-existent "murder" (BTW the opening narration made an error in referencing the pilot by not making it clear that the creature is held responsible for the death of a fellow scientist killed in an *accidental* explosion. The longer narration used only in "Death In The Family" did make this clear but the regular series used the narration "The creature is wanted for a murder he didn't commit." The uninitiated viewer dropping without seeing the pilot might get the wrong idea there's a phantom one-armed man who needs to be found!)

Of course I always felt David's reason for "letting the world think he is dead" was weak to begin with. It would have made far more sense for David to approach his colleagues and put him in the best possible position to use their resources to get a cure (but if he doesn't do this, we have no "Fugitive" style template to provide most of our stories). And had David realized that the proof needed to clear the Hulk of Susan's death was staring him in the face with McGee's actions it would have been easier.

Which brings me to another point about the series and the obsession of McGee. McGee is anxious to prove the creature is responsible for two deaths yet the secret the series never reveals is that he is the one more responsible for what happened than anyone else (albeit unintentionally). Perhaps his obsessive pursuit is driven by a desire to escape confronting the fact that he caused the explosion that set things in motion?

I actually once wrote a stand-alone fanfic story intended to be a "last" episode to bring closure to the series (disregarding those awful post-series TV movies with Thor, Daredevil etc.). The hitch was David finally realizing what the evidence was needed to clear himself and realizing that he needed to stop running and really seek help in a more productive way. I posted it on a Hulk discussion board and I was glad it was received nicely by those who are bigger fans of the series than I am.

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AndyDursin
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Re: INCREDIBLE HULK - TV Series Revisitation Thread

#3 Post by AndyDursin »

The longer narration used only in "Death In The Family" did make this clear but the regular series used the narration "The creature is wanted for a murder he didn't commit."
I noticed this when I was watching the episode! I was thinking it was due to the narration being shortened for syndication.

Was A DEATH IN THE FAMILY a "2nd pilot" or just another TV movie? Did the show premiere in mid-season? I know I can look it up but I've forgotten.

Eric Paddon
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Re: INCREDIBLE HULK - TV Series Revisitation Thread

#4 Post by Eric Paddon »

I think it did function as a second pilot of sorts to set up the "here he is on the run" format which of course the initial one didn't do. But then it did have a short first season only seven episodes or so immediately following in early 78.

Yes, the short narration was always part of the regular series.

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Paul MacLean
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Re: INCREDIBLE HULK - TV Series Revisitation Thread

#5 Post by Paul MacLean »




Late to this thread I know, but that is one of the truly great unintentionally funny moments in TV history. :lol:

And of course Andy, we can't forget "Enzyme Seven" either...


KevinEK
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Re: INCREDIBLE HULK - TV Series Revisitation Thread

#6 Post by KevinEK »

A few thoughts on this, given my own experience with the show and with its creator, Kenneth Johnson.

First, as I may have indicated in the past, if you go to Kenny's website and go to his Hulk page, you'll find a list I compiled in Berkeley back in the early 90s in the dawning days of the Sci Fi Channel, of all the reasons I could assemble for how they got David Banner to hulk out. Or you could just google my name and hulk out and you'll get to the same place. Some of the provocations are truly inspired.

When I first worked with Gerald McRaney on JAG in 2000, I asked him a simple question about his work on The Hulk: "If you've had enough of this guy David Blockhead nosing around your business and you beat him up and you throw him into a closet and there are no other doors or windows to this closet other than the one you just used, and there's nothing in the closet but some old clothes, and 30 seconds later a big green monster comes back out of that closet wearing David Blockhead's clothes, WHY do you then say 'Hey, where'd that thing come from?'" Mac thought about it for a moment and then said "Because I'm a dummy". Then he continued, "You know, you're the only person who's ever asked me that. Except my son. When he was EIGHT."


There's a LOT of unintentional comedy in the series, including multiple lines in the second pilot ("He ate the whole thing, bones and all!") and many other things you can see on my list.

Kenny's commentary on the various eps he directed is indispensable for understanding how the show worked and what was happening on it. I highly recommend his commentaries because he would prepare for those by going back through the episodes, reading through the callsheets and scheduling materials and generally putting himself back into the mindset of where he was when they shot these eps. He also would update his information by checking up on whatever information is around online about where various cast went afterwards. Kenny actually did a commentary in person for me for "Prometheus", the 4th season opener where we sat together for an afternoon and talked it through while watching it. (For the record, Kenny's Hulk commentaries are on the first pilot, "Married" and "Prometheus")

During the filming of the first pilot, when Bixby delivered the "Don't make me angry" line to Jack Colvin, he originally played it angry. Kenny had him do it again, but playing it as a joke - and that's the take that lives forever now.

The second pilot was indeed designed as a setup for how the series would properly function. The first pilot took its time to set up David Banner and create the situation that puts him on the run. The second pilot was intended to show how the series could function on a weekly basis. (I recall that second pilot being advertised on TV as the Revenge of the Hulk back in 1977 but who knows if my memory is playing tricks on me) They did a little more work to finesse it and came up with the basic formula of 2 hulkouts per episode and plots that could function to allow Bixby to have sensitive moments with the "friend for the episode" before inevitably he would be provoked into turning into Lou Ferrigno.

We can look at the clumsy setup for the show now as a head scratcher, but at the time for network TV, it was plenty to motivate David Banner constantly on the run. There was another point that they would periodically return to in the series - that David Banner is constantly worried about the Hulk's potential to injure or kill someone. He is told by Elaina Marks in the first pilot that the creature will not kill because David is not a killer - but that only refers to something he is aware he's doing. The Hulk is usually on a rampage as far as David's perception goes, so who knows what it will do? (Occasionally, the show played this situation the other way when it was convenient - such as the 4th season ep where David encounters another man with his hulkout problem, and the other man really IS a killer) There's the notion of having him just stay in a secure facility with trained scientists, and I'd agree that this would be a more sensible idea. The show tries to get around that by saying that he already tried it, and the result as far as David knows was the explosion and wreckage of the Southwest Facility at the end of the first pilot.

Kenny put a good group of people together to make The Incredible Hulk, although it should be acknowledged this was happening at Universal Studios in the middle of their 70s TV heyday. During that time, there were a lot of people that would actually just work for Universal and be assigned out to work on the shows. That's not the way anything works now, but that was the old studio system. At Universal, this was quite a machine. People doing my job in scheduling would need to rush down to a special office once they'd broken down the needs of each episode they prepared. This office had a map of the backlot and the soundstages and you'd have to use colored pushpins to indicate which stages you were going to need to use for your swing sets. And with the Hulk, pretty much everything was a swing set. If you didn't get to that office early enough in everyone's scheduling periods, you'd wind up having to move in and out of multiple stages spread across the lot...

The actual production of the series only ran for 4 seasons. There was the initial year, which encompassed the two pilots and the short season of 10 eps. I note that several eps of the first season used lifted footage from other universal productions, including "Duel" and "Airport 75", something that made the original filmmakers really unhappy, for obvious reasons. The 4th season opener, "Prometheus" was actually shot at the end of the 3rd season and banked for the fall premiere. Kenny told me this was a fairly stressful shoot, and I would assess part of this to the difficulty of the episode and part of it to them doing it as their last episode at the end of a long year. During the 4th season, in early 1981, they filmed seven episodes that were meant to be banked and mixed into a regular 5th season. But the guy who was running CBS at the time decided that they didn't need to keep making more episodes. Kenny wanted to at least film a Series Finale for the show, as he wanted to make the point that David Banner could in the end solve his problem, but the exec wouldn't budge. So the 5th season of the Hulk consisted of the 7 new eps aired around a bunch of re-runs and pre-empts. Kenny described the exec to me as "a life support system for a toupee".

With the Hulk over by mid-1981, and with Kenny's Cliff Hangers show having not worked out, he moved on to "V", which I think was probably the best work of his career. Sadly, that one really didn't work out between him and NBC. Kenny explains that on the commentary he did for the miniseries - way too long to get into here.

Somehow by the latter 80s, Bixby was able to get people interested in a restart of The Hulk, only combining the character with other Marvel heroes. The first one of these was put together by Bixby and Nicholas Corea, who'd done a bunch of writing and some directing on the Kenny Johnson series. The second two of the movies were directed by Bixby, who intended to do more but was never able to as he was diagnosed with cancer and did not survive it. I have always found the reunion movies hard to watch, as the first two are really cheesy (although John Rhys Davies makes for a pretty interesting Kingpin in the second one) and the third one is simply ridiculous. And I really don't think the Bixby Hulk setup is the same without the Joe Harnell music.

Eric Paddon
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Re: INCREDIBLE HULK - TV Series Revisitation Thread

#7 Post by Eric Paddon »

Appreciate your thoughts and perspective on the series, Kevin. Did Kenny ever get his proposed Finale to any kind of a script or outline just to indicate what the general plot would have been? Certainly a confrontation moment with McGee would have been great to see where McGee finally realizes the truth.

If I'm not mistaken, Spielberg's anger over "Duel" footage being used led to a new rule restricting that kind of lifting of stock footage to construct an episode around.

I only endured the reunion films once but I do think the Harnell theme was at least used at the end of each one. That was my recollection (I always envisioned that for a true last episode focused on David realizing he can be helped and people are there to help him the ending could do the Harnell theme in a full orchestral arrangement for the first time since it would mean David was no longer a "lonely man".)

KevinEK
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Re: INCREDIBLE HULK - TV Series Revisitation Thread

#8 Post by KevinEK »

My understanding of the intended series finale for The Incredible Hulk is that Kenny never actually wrote it. It was more of an idea he had about where he wanted to go for the ending. The one thing he told me about it was that he wanted David Banner to be able to cure himself. I've heard speculation that it would have involved a trial and all that, but I've never seen anything concrete. Knowing Kenny, he would have tried to wrap things up in a pretty conclusive manner, including Jack McGee. For all I know, he could still write a book of that - he actually did write a book of his proposed sequel to V, which matched up with a description he'd given me a few years earlier. Actually, come to think of it, I think I have a script copy somewhere in my attic of V: The Second Generation. Basic idea was to call back to the ending of the V miniseries where Faye Grant sends a message to the Visitors' enemies asking for help, which she's told could take 20 years. So the sequel series would start out 20 years later with the enemies showing up on our doorstep, only to see that the Visitors have taken most of the planet's water supply. He had a great image for the opening of the show that involved a chase or dogfight over a desert, and then you either pull back or pull up to reveal the Golden Gate Bridge and realize this is an emptied San Francisco Bay.

Spielberg was infuriated by the use of the "Duel" footage, and I've heard the same story that he made absolutely certain after that to have a clause in his contracts that forbade the studios from repurposing his footage for anything other than his movies. By the way, something similar happened on JAG with a first season episode where they lifted the convoy attack from "Clear and Present Danger" and dropped it into their own show with a little doubling and finessing. Again, the director was infuriated and it was pretty embarrassing. But that was before I got there - I didn't arrive until the first ep of the 2nd season.

The Hulk reunion movies did use the Harnell "Lonely Man" theme for their endings or wherever they could, but the movies were missing a lot of other crucial bits - particularly when it came to the transformation sound you'd hear when David Banner's eyes would go white. And the fun music Harnell would play as Banner would become increasingly restive before having the old metamorphosis...

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